Don't know if any of you guys visit the El Mirage dry lake bed and OHV area, but the BLM is going to start charging fees there now, starting October 1.
http://www.blm.gov/ca/st/en/fo/barstow/mirage.2.html
El Mirage OHV fees start Oct 1
Really? I thought everyone knew it's to fight wars (and if there aren't any handy we'll make some) and pay for the needs of an aging Baby Boom.Tim wrote:You've got to wonder what we already pay taxes for
Government-provided recreation will always get hind tit, that's a given, and I don't mind paying a modest fee for it. Hell, it's still a lot less than what people happily pay for all kinds of brainless "recreations" like going to movies and eating out.
The BLM isn't really in the recreation business, and the ongoing care and management of El Mirage must be a lot more than they are used to doing. Ditto the Forest Service, which unlike the Park Service is really supposed to be making money from the exploitation of mineral and timber resources, so again the Adventure Pass parking fee never bothered me, since I'm not otherwise a paying customer of the Forest Service.
I try to make it out to El Mirage every month from May through November for the SCTA land speed trials. I missed last month, but I should be there the weekend of 13-14 September.
Nunc est bibendum
Isn't El Mirage getting a little trashed? Fees might help if they put some of the money back into the place. Last time I was out there it seemed to be litter everywhere. Even at the far northwestern side of the lakebed litter was never far away (maybe too may people 'loving' the area to death?)
A contrast is the Bonneville Salt Flats area. Although fees are charged for organizations, the Salt Flats are free for the casual visitor as long as no organization has reserved the area you want to go to. Also, organized events are required to charge a minimum $4 daily fee for all visitors. You just have to remember you're driving on salt/potash; it can have soft spots that'll trap your vehicle, and you've got to wash your undercarriage soon after driving on it or it'll corrode you car (or ruin your electrical system!). The BLM also polices the area during events to make sure all contamination is cleaned up. Fines are imposed.
This year's schedule at the "Raceway":
http://www.blm.gov/ut/st/en/fo/salt_lak ... ville.html
Very cool to see in person. I'd suggest going to see one of the USFRA's events; mostly amateurs who love cars, with some great home made vehicles.
A contrast is the Bonneville Salt Flats area. Although fees are charged for organizations, the Salt Flats are free for the casual visitor as long as no organization has reserved the area you want to go to. Also, organized events are required to charge a minimum $4 daily fee for all visitors. You just have to remember you're driving on salt/potash; it can have soft spots that'll trap your vehicle, and you've got to wash your undercarriage soon after driving on it or it'll corrode you car (or ruin your electrical system!). The BLM also polices the area during events to make sure all contamination is cleaned up. Fines are imposed.
This year's schedule at the "Raceway":
http://www.blm.gov/ut/st/en/fo/salt_lak ... ville.html
Very cool to see in person. I'd suggest going to see one of the USFRA's events; mostly amateurs who love cars, with some great home made vehicles.
I haven't noticed, but then I am usually there for SCTA events, and the SCTA themselves police the lakebed prior to meets.phydeux wrote:Isn't El Mirage getting a little trashed?
But El Mirage is certainly getting a lot more use these days. I've been going there for over thirty years and back in the seventies, though dirt-biking was more popular then, you didn't see nearly as many motorcycles and such at El Mirage. I think that was because the desert was more open to motorcycles then and El Mirage is actually a pretty boring place to ride a motorcycle. Now El Mirage is one of the few places a motorcycling family can legally go.
I have no doubt the SCTA works pretty closely with the BLM and probably pays all kinds of use fees. But SCTA events are free, thank god. I think it would be far too much of an administrative hassle for the SCTA to charge for admission to the dry lake and a 1.3 mile racecourse. And it would be a bummer for people like me who just like to drive out there and camp anywhere on the lakebed we want and drink beer and wander around the campsites and talk about cars with greybeard motorheads. But I don't mind paying a few bucks at a kiosk just to gain entrance to the lakebed.A contrast is the Bonneville Salt Flats area. Although fees are charged for organizations, the Salt Flats are free for the casual visitor as long as no organization has reserved the area you want to go to. Also, organized events are required to charge a minimum $4 daily fee for all visitors.
In fact, now that I think of it, I wouldn't be surprised if the new BLM fees were part of a compromise between the SCTA and the BLM, where the burden of collecting the necessary fees is shifted to the BLM instead of the SCTA.
Nunc est bibendum
I've been out to El Mirage maybe half a dozen times over the last 5 years. We'd go there to test fly new model airplanes because just like with real airplanes, if something goes wrong you can land in any direction on a dry lake bed.
The times that I've been out there, El Mirage was not trashed. There were a few BLM patrols but people policed themselves pretty well. The only facilities are several outhouses. However, these are only my anecdotal experiences and maybe it does get trashed after a big event.
I remember the first time I went there, I thought this place was really cool. You had so much freedom to do whatever you want (as long as it was safe and it didn't destroy the place). Guys in strange Russian ultra lights would land and taxi right up to you and chat or they would fly in formation with my car just 20 feet above me. The point is, out here it felt like for a short time we were really free. Now with fees, it’s literally not free. You're going to have fences, kiosks...just another Disneyland.
For those who can afford the fees, I'm sure it's no problem to them. But what about the kid in Adelanto who just wants to have some fun on the dry lake bed? $15/day is not cheap when it's twice the minimum wage.
I don't like it. Some things like parks and recreation and emergency services should be free (already paid for by general tax revenues) so that all can enjoy. These things should be for the common good.
The times that I've been out there, El Mirage was not trashed. There were a few BLM patrols but people policed themselves pretty well. The only facilities are several outhouses. However, these are only my anecdotal experiences and maybe it does get trashed after a big event.
I remember the first time I went there, I thought this place was really cool. You had so much freedom to do whatever you want (as long as it was safe and it didn't destroy the place). Guys in strange Russian ultra lights would land and taxi right up to you and chat or they would fly in formation with my car just 20 feet above me. The point is, out here it felt like for a short time we were really free. Now with fees, it’s literally not free. You're going to have fences, kiosks...just another Disneyland.
For those who can afford the fees, I'm sure it's no problem to them. But what about the kid in Adelanto who just wants to have some fun on the dry lake bed? $15/day is not cheap when it's twice the minimum wage.
I don't like it. Some things like parks and recreation and emergency services should be free (already paid for by general tax revenues) so that all can enjoy. These things should be for the common good.
Used to go out there in the late 1970's-early 1980's to star gaze. A lot fewer people in the desert and Los Angeles back then, so easy to see lots of stuff in the night sky. I'd also think that was a time when fewer people visited the area, and the desert could 'absorb' their impact. The increase in population in the greater L.A. area, with a corresponding increase in persons in the desert, probably tipped the balance (at least from my vantage point). Also, star gazing is a lot less dramatic out there these days as the increase in lighting "washes out" the sky.
As for fees, don't forget the Interior Dept's budget (along with those of the NPS/NFS) has been slashed over the last 30 years, and we're seeing the impact of it in less federal oversight of the area. Sad, but that's the reality, and it seems they're trying to make it up with some type of fee structure.
As for fees, don't forget the Interior Dept's budget (along with those of the NPS/NFS) has been slashed over the last 30 years, and we're seeing the impact of it in less federal oversight of the area. Sad, but that's the reality, and it seems they're trying to make it up with some type of fee structure.