Charlton Peak 1.26.11

norma r · Post by **norma r** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:24 pm

Took a great little hike yesterday to Charlton Peak with Jim (Calicokat) and guess what?... There's snow in the San Gorgonio Wilderness!

It's not fresh snow but above Horse Meadows on the South Fork Trail the snow is hanging on. Gotta' love the north facing slopes! We booted it up to South Fork Meadow and then changed into our 'pons. It probably would have been better to wear the snowshoes, but we were too lazy to stop again and make the change. We found the summit of Charlton windy and cold, but the views of the SGW were awesome. After lunch back at SF Meadow we strapped on the snowshoes and wore them for the majority of the hike out. Not that the snow was soft & deep but it was hard and slick down there and the crampons on our 'shoes provided some grip as we walked out.

Didn't see a soul all day but we did see carnage on the SF Trail caused by the heavy wet snow that fell at the end of Dec which proved too great a ballast for the smaller forest trees. Broken trees everywhere.

The hightlight of the day... the views, oh the views!!!

Beautiful Mount San Gorgonio

The Big Draw

Jepson Peak

Ninjim amid the SF Trail carnage

Me making a "C" on the summit of Charlton

The NW Ridge of San G is doable but i can't wait for those cornices to drop so we can climb and play on the bowls of SG, BD and the chutes of Jepson. Stats: 11 miles, approx 4k elev gain, 9.75 hrs

p.s. Almost forgot, thanks to Kathy Wing for your track from your hike of Charlton last weekend. We used it and even followed your snowshoes track on the final bump.

rest of my pix are here:
http://picasaweb.google.com/ryan.norma8 ... nPeak12611#

Post by **Hikin_Jim** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:27 pm

Nice photos, Norma.

HJ

lik2hik · Post by **lik2hik** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:44 pm

Looks like the perfect hike in perfect weather! Great report and pics! Nice going guys.

Sam Page · Post by **Sam Page** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:54 pm

Well that looks like the place to be right now, although those cornices are a tad worrying.

Nice job getting up Charlton and thanks for the informative post and stunning photos.

lilbitmo · Post by **lilbitmo** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:34 pm

Very Nice Norma, time to get to south fork soon, the snow around here is disappearing fast.

Ninja Jim, is he carrying a double pack, one in front and one in back? Or just camera equipment out front?

norma r · Post by **norma r** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:54 pm

camera equipment. plus, i think it wears it to keep him balanced! 8)

MattCav · Post by **MattCav** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:43 pm

great t.r., norma! i REALLY need to get that ice axe and helmet ASAP so i can head out thataway. that looks like funnnnn!

hvydrt · Post by **hvydrt** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:57 am

norma r wrote: Didn't see a soul all day

Nice! It amazes me how few people use that area, especially during the week!

He219 · Post by **He219** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:03 am

Awesome! Looks great.
Thanks for the TR.

Burchey · Post by **Burchey** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 8:12 am

Sam Page wrote: Well that looks like the place to be right now, although those cornices are a tad worrying.

Oh, I wouldn't worry about them, they aren't at all worried about you - trust me.

Besides, if an avalanche comes, just do a really good self-arrest. The snow will just roll over you and you'll be fine.

TracieB · Post by **TracieB** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:14 am

Beautiful photos, Norma! Looks like you two had a great day. I have to agree with Sam, though on those cornices.

Burchey · Post by **Burchey** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:17 am

TracieB wrote: Beautiful photos, Norma! Looks like you two had a great day. I have to agree with Sam, though on those cornices.

I'm tellin' ya, Tracie - just think positive and keep your pick sharp - no problem! You could also just jump at the right moment and the snow will pass under you as it goes down.

Dave G · Post by **Dave G** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:44 am

I wouldn't be too concerned about them cornices. They look exactly the same as they did three weeks ago, so they've obviously become a permafrost accessory to the mtn.

But just in case I'm wrong--be careful out there!

Burchey · Post by **Burchey** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:54 am

On a serious note ( with plans to study a lot more about avalanche danger / avoiding certain conditions )...how would you deal with faces like that? If it's been several weeks without new snow, is it even remotely safe to head up that side of the mountain? I know you have to consider recent temps, wind conditions, sun exposure, etc.

I doubt most folks on here cut holes in the hill, etc to test the snow conditions, how do you guys with a lot of experience make judgement calls on which route to take? Gut feeling based on prior success/error in similar conditions? Sorry to hijack the thread.

Post by **Hikin_Jim** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:29 pm

Burchey wrote: Sorry to hijack the thread.

I can't believe it.

Talking about mountains on a mountains discussion forum.

Knock it off would ya?

HJ

He219 · Post by **He219** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:33 pm

Burchey wrote: .. how do you guys make judgement calls on which route to take? Gut feeling based on prior success/error in similar conditions? Sorry to hijack the thread.

There are four major signs that you should look for (red flags):
1. Recent Activity, other slides natural or man-made
Natural slides will tell you the snow is unstable.
2. Recent amount of snowfall
90% of all avalanches happen during or within 24 hours after a storm.
Be aware, hear whoopfing, cracking or shooting cracks; red flag - indicative of collapse
3. Wind loading; cornices near ridges onto the downhill/leeward side of ridges.
Slopes below those ridges are inherently loaded, potentially with slabs. Slabs are prone to slide.
4. Rapid warming over a day, wet slab potential for slides

Be aware of your environment and situation, focus on your senses.

Hope that helps, Jackson!

Burchey · Post by **Burchey** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 1:01 pm

He219 wrote:
Burchey wrote: .. how do you guys make judgement calls on which route to take? Gut feeling based on prior success/error in similar conditions? Sorry to hijack the thread.
There are four major signs that you should look for (red flags):
1. Recent Activity, other slides natural or man-made
Natural slides will tell you the snow is unstable.
2. Recent amount of snowfall
90% of all avalanches happen during or within 24 hours after a storm.
Be aware, hear whoopfing, cracking or shooting cracks; red flag - indicative of collapse
3. Wind loading; cornices near ridges onto the downhill/leeward side of ridges.
Slopes below those ridges are inherently loaded, potentially with slabs. Slabs are prone to slide.
4. Rapid warming over a day, wet slab potential for slides

Be aware of your environment and situation, focus on your senses.

Hope that helps, Jackson!

You.The.Man. I'm pretty familiar with those issues, gonna read up as much as possible, and try to stay alert. Otherwise, I'll just stick to my "jumping the avalanche" technique.

Post by **Hikin_Jim** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 1:52 pm

Burchey wrote:
He219 wrote:
Burchey wrote: .. how do you guys make judgement calls on which route to take? Gut feeling based on prior success/error in similar conditions? Sorry to hijack the thread.
There are four major signs that you should look for (red flags):
1. Recent Activity, other slides natural or man-made
Natural slides will tell you the snow is unstable.
2. Recent amount of snowfall
90% of all avalanches happen during or within 24 hours after a storm.
Be aware, hear whoopfing, cracking or shooting cracks; red flag - indicative of collapse
3. Wind loading; cornices near ridges onto the downhill/leeward side of ridges.
Slopes below those ridges are inherently loaded, potentially with slabs. Slabs are prone to slide.
4. Rapid warming over a day, wet slab potential for slides

Be aware of your environment and situation, focus on your senses.

Hope that helps, Jackson!
You.The.Man. I'm pretty familiar with those issues, gonna read up as much as possible, and try to stay alert. Otherwise, I'll just stick to my "jumping the avalanche" technique.

If your local library has a copy of Mountaineering: Freedom of the Hills, they have some pretty good sections on snow. I didn't know there was a life cycle of snow before I picked up a copy of that book.

HJ

Burchey · Post by **Burchey** » Fri Jan 28, 2011 2:05 pm

Hikin_Jim wrote: If your local library has a copy of Mountaineering: Freedom of the Hills, they have some pretty good sections on snow. I didn't know there was a life cycle of snow before I picked up a copy of that book.

HJ

It's on my nightstand. Oh yeah.

norma r · Post by **norma r** » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:54 am

i'll be taking an avy course soon, so i'll know more (and fear more?) then, but as i hear it the north slopes of San G et al, slide later in the season. there is a reason Mammoth is always blasting their cornices. not good for P.R. to loose customers.

as i see it from my limited knowledge and the laws of gravity, a big 'ole hanging cornice is prob not gonna' just melt away. at some point it's gonna' give and... drop.

jjpicts · Post by **jjpicts** » Mon Jan 31, 2011 2:33 pm

norma r wrote: as i see it from my limited knowledge and the laws of gravity, a big 'ole hanging cornice is prob not gonna' just melt away. at some point it's gonna' give and... drop.

I'll be going up the N. chute of San G. on Sat. I'll dig a little in those and let you know how consolidated they are.