EISPIRATEN

They cite people for walking on it?

HJ

good. pretty much all the reasons for opening up that section are B.S anyways, and everyone knew it was going to be a big PITA to keep open.

I hope this doesn't mean fewer urban burritos north of Crystal Lake!

1. Gimme the keys to the gates.
2. How in the hell would that road ever stay open?
3. Y'all shoulda given up many years ago.
4. Tunnel under Windy Gap

Thank me later, CalTrans.

Yup, excellent news!

This makes me rethink my position that caltrans has no brain, maybe they went to emerald city and saw the wizard!

AW wrote: ↑Then they should give up ownership of it...

The FS won't take it back unless CalTrans restores it to it's natural state.

HJ

This reminds me of the road through Wildrose Canyon in Death Valley. It was originally paved, but the asphalt is washed out now. I assume that it dawned on Caltrans that it was impossible to keep that stretch repaired.

Hikin_Jim wrote: ↑They cite people for walking on it?

HJ

Sure. They were issuing tickets if people walked on Hwy39 past Upper Bear Creek trail....now the gate has moved north quite a bit is all.

I know they have to restore it to a natural state to give it to the Forest service, but thats what it should be then. Instead of continuing to spend even more maintaining a one lane emergency road.

AW wrote: ↑I know they have to restore it to a natural state to give it to the Forest service, but thats what it should be then. Instead of continuing to spend even more maintaining a one lane emergency road.

I think, if I understood things correctly, that it's actually cheaper to maintain the one-lane road than it is to restore it to its natural state. Apparently restoration is quite expensive.

I'm not opposed to restoration; just stating what I've heard.

HJ

I don't know, if you walk down hwy 39 you get the impression the mountains will restore it to its natural state in not too much time - the rock slides appear to be near constant.

Elwood wrote:
"I hope this doesn't mean fewer urban burritos north of Crystal Lake!"


Sorry, but it's this sort of comment that makes people living in communities like Azusa feel that they are being banned from their forest by people who don't like them for just looking different.

Ever been to the San Gabriel River?

I think what most people don't like are dirty diapers, broken beer bottles and MOUNTAINS of trash left by people who treat the forest as if it were their back yard (or front yard depending on the neighborhood).

I'll tell you what I'll do ARM; let's meet at the mouth of San Gabriel Canyon one Saturday or Sunday. We'll drive up the canyon and pull over at all of the popular areas. We'll park, get out, and walk around and you can tell me what YOU see. Perhaps you could even hold a few streamside chats on environmental education. You game?

I like people of all stripes and I enjoy the differences in culture, and that's what we have here, a difference in culture. There is a certain segment of the population whose culture condones tagging rocks and trees and leaving diapers and trash strewn about the forest because that is how they live in their own neighborhood. Sorry, but 25-years of familiarity with San Gabriel Canyon has only served to enforce certain stereotypes, not dissuade them.

So, when do you want to go?

Sorry, you missed my point, but you are right too. I agree, there is a huge mess caused by people who don't care about their impacts on the mountain, but education is the only way to change it, not by calling them names and making them feel like they are inferior for their looks.

I've been hiking the canyon and all over the mountain since the mid 70's, and have noticed the changes you speak of over those 35 or so years.

The trash problem is caused by all sorts of people who visit the mountains - a lot of people are just not that aware about environmental issues, and don't see or care about what they are doing to the forest.

The problem has been getting worse now that schools don't teach environmental education anymore. Ever been to a week of outdoor education camp in 6th grade? That's what got me into pursuing an environmental career. Schools just can't do those anymore and so the kids, and the mountains, suffer for it. Many of the inner city kids that live at the base of the ANF who are given opportunities to go on fieldtrips or have programs in school that deal with the environment do care. They will have families of their own, and will want to go camping, hiking, etc. up on the mountain too. If they feel that the place belongs to them, and they care about it, the mountain will be the better for it.

The comment I referred to was just not very helpful for this effort.

this is great for us cyclists but couldnt they just run the sweeper up and back once a year?

It would appear to me that someone has deleted a message that reflects an understandable but absolutely wrong interpretation of my comment. An urban burrito is simply slang for one of the multitude of soiled diapers left trailside, roadside, creekside, etc. Other than the ethnic specificity of the foodstuff referenced, it is not a slur against any group. Ill be sure to refer to them in the future as urban kreplach or urban blintzes.

Don't forget the dosa. Everyone has a the right to be offended

Don't be deceived. Hwy 39 is a communist plot.

HJ

Elwood wrote: ↑It would appear to me that someone has deleted a message that reflects an understandable but absolutely wrong interpretation of my comment. An urban burrito is simply slang for one of the multitude of soiled diapers left trailside, roadside, creekside, etc. Other than the ethnic specificity of the foodstuff referenced, it is not a slur against any group. Ill be sure to refer to them in the future as urban kreplach or urban blintzes.

Well thanks, Elwood, I did misunderstand your intent, along with another commenter it seems. No harm done. It's too bad that the issue I raised is such a hot button. It would be nice to someday find a solution to the problem of having a limited amount of solitude and bliss surrounded like an island by so many who want to go see and play in it.

It seems that we only have a few choices though for the San Gabriel, San Bernardino San Jacinto Mtns. We can either let them go, keep everyone out, or keep putting on limits to where and how many can go in... Unless, does anyone know how to make an island disapear and move through time?

Well thanks, Elwood, I did misunderstand your intent, along with another commenter it seems.

Well, if you're referring to me, I did not misunderstand the comment. In fact the first thing I alluded to was that people are upset with dirty diapers and mountains of trash. YOU were the one that suggested that people were biased about the way people LOOK. I suggested that it wasn't their looks that folks object to, but their behavior. Big difference.

Anyone have any more details on the "issuing tickets to pedestrian thing"?
And what about cyclists?

EManBevHills wrote: ↑Anyone have any more details on the "issuing tickets to pedestrian thing"?
And what about cyclists?

I think that was more about fire closure than Hwy 39 itself. Anyone got anything further on that?

HJ

Hikin_Jim wrote: ↑

EManBevHills wrote: ↑Anyone have any more details on the "issuing tickets to pedestrian thing"?
And what about cyclists?

I think that was more about fire closure than Hwy 39 itself. Anyone got anything further on that?

HJ

http://glendoramtnroad.blogspot.com/201 ... ay-39.html

Its $200 according to "yeahian". That wasnt the only I read, but the only one I remember about cyclists. It is defintely about them not wanting the public on the road while they work....although they make talk about their legal liability in case something goes wrong for you. That and they dont need any vandals going up there.

AW wrote: ↑

Hikin_Jim wrote: ↑

EManBevHills wrote: ↑Anyone have any more details on the "issuing tickets to pedestrian thing"?
And what about cyclists?

I think that was more about fire closure than Hwy 39 itself. Anyone got anything further on that?

HJ

http://glendoramtnroad.blogspot.com/201 ... ay-39.html

Its $200 according to "yeahian". That wasnt the only I read, but the only one I remember about cyclists. It is defintely about them not wanting the public on the road while they work....although they make talk about their legal liability in case something goes wrong for you. That and they dont need any vandals going up there.

That was actually for "long boarders," but I get the idea. Sounds like they're serious about it.

Is there a sign to that effect? I don't recall ever seeing one.

HJ

From today's Tribune:
Hwy 39

I hope Caltrans will abandon only the closed section.

Road to nowhere, meet Bridge to nowhere?

I get that it's costly - but don't easily maintainable roads soak up the cost of the expensive ones? Isn't Highway 2 a million times more expensive?

Would Highway 2 get the same treatment if there weren't more people ready to make a fuss for it? But then I guess The 2 goes through... hang on...

Where's PIA when you need him?

Today's "environmentalists" aren't your father's environmentalists.

Longtime cabin owner and environmental activist Glen Owens was dumbfounded over what some are calling a Caltrans trial balloon.

"Why would a state agency try to shirk its responsibilities and then think another government agency would take those over?"

Recently, Azusa businesses, cabin owners and some environmental groups lobbied for repairing the 4.4-mile section. They say having full circulation into Wrightwood and its ski areas, and into the high desert and La Canada Flintridge area, will bring more shoppers to the foothill cities of the San Gabriel Valley.

Since when do "environmentalists" lobby for more highways through the forests and mountains?

these people are full of shit.

play around with google maps. Of course the time estimates aren't perfect, but from downtown Asuza to downtown Wrightwood via 210 and 15 ~ 65 minutes.

From Asuza to Crystal Lake = 37 mins.
4.4 closed part of 39 = ???
From Islp Saddle to Wrightwood = 25 mins.

How is opening the end of the 39 really going to add business to Azusa again?

Zé wrote: ↑How is opening the end of the 39 really going to add business to Azusa again?

People will flock from Azusa to the Starbucks that will go in next to the restroom at Islip Saddle. But, to get there they will want to fill up at the Starbucks on Foothill near Azusa Ave. That will be a boost to the local economy.

Odd touch they added about Adam speaking "broken English." My conversations with him led me to believe he's anything but an "immigrant" with language issues. IIRC Adam told us once that he used to be in "banking",