Bobcat Fire: closure info, what's open

robow8 · Post by **robow8** » Wed Mar 02, 2022 7:39 pm

I saw a post on FB from Adams Pack Station that the Chantry Flats road is being worked on and it will be closed for at least eight months. Does this seem like poor management to you?

maxmapper · Post by **maxmapper** » Mon Mar 14, 2022 11:48 pm

I heard from the ANF recreation field supervisor that "From what I’m hearing the areas within the Bobcat Closure will reopen when the closure expires, save for two small areas that will fall under new/extended closures."

Tom Sovinec · Post by **Tom Sovinec** » Thu Mar 31, 2022 11:28 am

From the Los Angeles Times:

https://www.latimes.com/lifestyle/newsl ... s-the-wild

maxmapper · Post by **maxmapper** » Thu Mar 31, 2022 12:05 pm

I made a new interactive map on CalTopo https://trailangeles.org/posts/detailed ... pril-2022/

Post by **Taco** » Fri Apr 01, 2022 7:08 pm

Supposed to have expired today, April 1. I may go up tomorrow to Cogswell to see what it’s like. Anyone been out yet?

maxmapper · Post by **maxmapper** » Sat Apr 02, 2022 4:06 pm

I tried to go up yesterday (Friday) and they had the road closed, and said they are doing sediment removal and don't want people on the road during the week. Turns out they issued a new closure order today that states the West Fork road is closed to the public during the week through December 2023, but it's open weekends and federal holidays during that time. Not sure what happens if you camp at Glenn Camp on a Sunday and try to come out Monday... will they ticket cars in the West Fork rec area parking lot on Monday morning?

Slowest_Hiker · Post by **Slowest_Hiker** » Sat Apr 02, 2022 5:37 pm

Hmph. I'm not seeing the new order.

maxmapper · Post by **maxmapper** » Sat Apr 02, 2022 5:50 pm

They posted two new PDFs on the ANF site but the PDFs are text only. The actual maps are only posted to Facebook. They really don't understand computers over there

Post by **Taco** » Sat Apr 02, 2022 7:48 pm

So it looks like they extendo'ed it to April 1 202fucking3. Fuck you.

Looks like Cogswell is being dredged or whatever to remove sediment "from April 1 to December 1, 2022, and during the same timeframe in 2023".

Did the forest circus find out how to install windows 95 plus yet or does that require a special safety course and sexual harassment/suicide prevention measures?

2023? April fools? Fuck you. And fuck the dumb yellow milf frogs up at fucking Williamson rock. Y'all cant even keep a bathroom open or pick up trash. Maybe you'll close Baldy again if someone dies on it 'for public safety'.

*image of a middle finger, i'm mad fuck off*

maxmapper · Post by **maxmapper** » Sat Apr 02, 2022 8:43 pm

Yes I can ride my bike up Highway 39 and get passed by 40 cars but apparently sharing West Fork road with the occasional dump truck is a public safety hazard

Post by **Sean** » Sun Apr 03, 2022 3:20 am

maxmapper wrote: ↑Yes I can ride my bike up Highway 39 and get passed by 40 cars but apparently sharing West Fork road with the occasional dump truck is a public safety hazard

They don't want you to witness all the bodies they'll be pulling out of the reservoir.

Slowest_Hiker · Post by **Slowest_Hiker** » Sun Apr 03, 2022 3:15 pm

Bummer. As a gesture of goodwill, they should open that gate to the dam that got put in on weekends also.

bcrowell · Post by **bcrowell** » Sun Apr 03, 2022 5:13 pm

maxmapper wrote:I tried to go up yesterday (Friday) and they had the road closed, and said they are doing sediment removal and don't want people on the road during the week. Turns out they issued a new closure order today that states the West Fork road is closed to the public during the week through December 2023, but it's open weekends and federal holidays during that time. Not sure what happens if you camp at Glenn Camp on a Sunday and try to come out Monday... will they ticket cars in the West Fork rec area parking lot on Monday morning?

Taco's rant notwithstanding, this is actually pretty reasonable by ANF standards. They explained the reason. The reason makes at least some sense. The restriction is only partial in order to allow some access, and it ends on a definite date.

It's awesome that the firefighters were able to prevent a situation where the whole front range would have looked like Mordor. Also awesome that the Fletcher Fund and other volunteers continue to work so hard on trail maintenance.

AW~ · Post by **AW~** » Mon Apr 04, 2022 12:36 pm

Sean wrote: ↑
maxmapper wrote: ↑Yes I can ride my bike up Highway 39 and get passed by 40 cars but apparently sharing West Fork road with the occasional dump truck is a public safety hazard
They don't want you to witness all the bodies they'll be pulling out of the reservoir.

They have been unsuccessful removing sediment ever since my time....10X the sediment comes in, with their narrow road its a joke..........but true, some bigfoot may have meet their watery grave. Good to know that will never see the public light of the day. Maybe scatter some flowers at the dam?
Well have to talk with the Angeles Forest office of extra human affairs....how is next of kin notified? Sure, someone at the office is entrusted with the funerals. I guess we send word out.

Post by **HikeUp** » Mon Apr 04, 2022 12:49 pm

You build a friggin dam and you don't have an adequate plan (logistics, infrastructure and funding) to remove the sediment? Color me not surprised.

They didn't clean the sediment that piled up behind Devil's Gate damn in Pasadena and lo and behold an intricate ecosystem thrived to the point where they can't remove the sediment now because they'd end up destroying this very same precious ecosystem. Color me not surprised.

AW~ · Post by **AW~** » Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:41 am

Well, I doubt they were thinking too far ahead in 1934....considering that Cogswell as built as a backup(in a hurry).
https://dpw.lacounty.gov/wrd/Projects/C ... l&site=wrd

I admit its a wokey/wonky/strategic subject, and that guy chained himself to a tree at Devils Gate. Maybe a trigger warning is in order.

Post by **HikeUp** » Tue Apr 05, 2022 10:55 am

WTF...if you're smart enough to build a dam, you are smart enough to know that sediment builds up behind every single god damn dam in the world. Ask any beaver and he'll tell ya so. If someone builds a dam and doesn't think of sediment removal then expect that dam to fail 'cause that guy's an idiot.

Now I need some quiet safe space time to nap in and recover.

Post by **Sean** » Tue Apr 05, 2022 1:57 pm

Gene · Post by **Gene** » Thu Apr 07, 2022 7:49 am

HikeUp wrote: ↑WTF...if you're smart enough to build a dam, you are smart enough to know that sediment builds up behind every single god damn dam in the world. Ask any beaver and he'll tell ya so. If someone builds a dam and doesn't think of sediment removal then expect that dam to fail 'cause that guy's an idiot.

Now I need some quiet safe space time to nap in and recover.

Actually, they did build in a solution, a sluice gate at the very base of the dam. Dams in the flood control system were not designed to provide permant lakes. The resivoirs were supposed to be drained down and sluiced fairly often, possibly even annually. Both Cogswell and San Gabriel dams have sluice gates, however, if you use them too seldom they allow the silt that would normally be washing down downstream with floodwaters and annual rainfall runoff, to build up and be dumped all at once. This is a problem for downstream dams, tends to oversilt downstream riverbeds, cause tons of enviromental headaches and frankly triggers the *pro flood/anti-dam folks.

*I say "pro-flood", because with the rainfall cycles and topography of South California, widespread flooding would occur without flood contol facilities, in particular, dams and debrie basins. If you doubt it, check the history of Southern California floods and keep in mind how much more land is developed now, in particular, flood plane land.

Post by **HikeUp** » Thu Apr 07, 2022 10:34 am

Gene wrote: ↑
HikeUp wrote: ↑WTF...if you're smart enough to build a dam, you are smart enough to know that sediment builds up behind every single god damn dam in the world. Ask any beaver and he'll tell ya so. If someone builds a dam and doesn't think of sediment removal then expect that dam to fail 'cause that guy's an idiot.

Now I need some quiet safe space time to nap in and recover.
Actually, they did build in a solution, a sluice gate at the very base of the dam. Dams in the flood control system were not designed to provide permant lakes. The resivoirs were supposed to be drained down and sluiced fairly often, possibly even annually. Both Cogswell and San Gabriel dams have sluice gates, however, if you use them too seldom they allow the silt that would normally be washing down downstream with floodwaters and annual rainfall runoff, to build up and be dumped all at once. This is a problem for downstream dams, tends to oversilt downstream riverbeds, cause tons of enviromental headaches and frankly triggers the *pro flood/anti-dam folks.

*I say "pro-flood", because with the rainfall cycles and topography of South California, widespread flooding would occur without flood contol facilities, in particular, dams and debrie basins. If you doubt it, check the history of Southern California floods and keep in mind how much more land is developed now, in particular, flood plane land.

So they didn't do regular "maintenance" (draining and sluicing on a regular schedule). Good to know that the engineer was competent!

Thanks for the info.

Post by **Taco** » Fri May 06, 2022 6:00 pm

Looks like Max Mapper updated the closure map. Thank you. The closed area is significantly smaller now. Thank you for making a map, since the USFS ones are typically grainy.

https://trailangeles.org/posts/detailed ... pril-2022/

Post by **Sean** » Tue Jul 18, 2023 7:23 am

Please note that part of the forest above Arcadia and Monrovia is still under a closure order. Basically the entire Big Santa Anita watershed is closed.

fseprd1111499 (1).pdf: (183.23 KiB) Downloaded 1175 times

fseprd1111500 (1).pdf: (835.29 KiB) Downloaded 1164 times

bcrowell · Post by **bcrowell** » Sun Jul 23, 2023 4:56 am

I don't normally go over there much anyway, so it's not a big deal to me, but I'm curious. Why is it still closed after such a long time?

Post by **Sean** » Sun Jul 23, 2023 8:51 pm

bcrowell wrote: ↑Why is it still closed after such a long time?

According to the website: "The purpose of the closure is to provide for public safety and to help the land recover naturally after the fire."

The canyon got hit hard by the Bobcat Fire, and I don't think the trails have been fixed yet.

Slowest_Hiker · Post by **Slowest_Hiker** » Sun Jul 23, 2023 9:29 pm

I think the fire followed by the rain is the main story. The Sturtevant camp page has some info if you go backwards in time.