Missing man near Millard (Albert Zisook)

Post by **Sean** » Sun Jul 02, 2023 2:05 pm

Altadena SAR is looking for Albert Zisook. He was last seen yesterday morning near Chaney Trail and Loma Alta.

KCAL News mention:

Post by **dima** » Sun Jul 02, 2023 6:47 pm

Matt and I ran into SAR today on the Idlehour trail. They were being thorough, and checking everywhere. Probably he's not over there, though since we saw nobody today or yesterday

AW~ · Post by **AW~** » Mon Jul 03, 2023 12:11 pm

"The Chaney Trail Rd gate will be closed to cars from June 30-July 6th due to fire risk. An alternative starting point is the Altadena Crest Trailhead from Loma Alta Park.
Consider an alternate hiking location for families and people with pets as the heat wave and air quality is unhealthy at this time.
The Angeles Forest wildfire danger has been heightened over this holiday Fourth of July weekend. There is no parking allowed on Chaney Trail Rd below the gate due to emergency access. Parking is not allowed on private roads. "

Am I getting this right? The usual trailhead is closed so the guy took the other way?

Post by **Sean** » Mon Jul 03, 2023 1:27 pm

That would be my guess.

David R · Post by **David R** » Mon Jul 03, 2023 2:11 pm

Weird place to get lost, probably fell unfortunately. I'm sure they looked near the falls. Trying to think of where else he could've fallen, I doubt he hiked that far on a hot day like that.

Post by **Uncle Rico** » Tue Jul 04, 2023 7:39 am

Not much to go on. A guy wearing glasses. From the news reports, it isn't even clear that he was actually hiking. He was just near a trail.

Post by **Sean** » Tue Jul 04, 2023 11:29 am

At least five SAR groups are looking for him now. I was privately informed that SAR has reason to suspect that he made it to upper Millard Canyon, which means they have a huge area to search. Assuming SAR has walked all the trails within ten or fifteen miles, odds are he went or fell off trail.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Thu Jul 06, 2023 12:25 pm

AW~ wrote: ↑Am I getting this right? The usual trailhead is closed so the guy took the other way?

i'm pretty sure they said his car was at loma alta and cheney. i read SAR left a note on his car that he was being looked for, in case he returned. he probably just hiked up the road.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Thu Jul 06, 2023 2:16 pm

someone has found what is presumably his alltrails account. the good news is he is decently experienced..

https://www.alltrails.com/en-gb/members/albert-zisook-1

AW~ · Post by **AW~** » Thu Jul 06, 2023 3:54 pm

courtney wrote: ↑someone has found what is presumably his alltrails account. the good news is he is decently experienced..

https://www.alltrails.com/en-gb/members/albert-zisook-1

Very interesting, though I dont have alltrails. I had wondered where his phone was....although thats now irrelevant.

David R · Post by **David R** » Fri Jul 07, 2023 10:57 am

Are they still searching for him, haven't seen any updates. There was media coverage and then complete blackout for the last three days. It would be nice to know which areas have been searched as I would go up there and look around but not interested in going through previously searched areas. I know one dude about 10 years got lost in the upper canyon but that must've been checked. Since he was experienced I was thinking Brown Mountain and that ridge which has some nice drop-offs.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Fri Jul 07, 2023 11:19 am

They are indeed still searching. Altadena Mountain Rescue and Sierra Madre SAR have been posting updates on social media. Pasadena Now also put out an article yesterday, i think. SMSAR has posted several photos and videos... the search area has seemingly been pretty large! There's a video of them heading up Brown Mountain yesterday posted by @helogoldy on instagram. AMR and SMSAR posted some ridges yesterday i couldn't ID. I've not been to Brown Mountain summit, so could be that? There's also a thread on the AMR facebook where some people were discussing areas they personally searched or ran into SAR in upper Millard. The thing is, of course, that if he fell off trail, they could have potentially walked by him and not known it. ? If anyone here followed the Bill Ewasko Joshua Tree story, there was one guy heavily involved in the 11 or 12 year search that really did walk just on the other side of some rocks from where hikers eventually found his remains.

Maybe Sean has more info about what's been searched, or things that aren't public?

David R · Post by **David R** » Fri Jul 07, 2023 1:00 pm

That's good to hear, I checked Altadena SAR Facebook and saw no new posts from them. I haven't seen any family interviews and unfortunately the squeaky wheel gets the oil with these types of things as far as intensity of search. Do you know if a copter has been involved in the search, they can get into those steep canyons and see spots that hikers can't. That was how the kid from Newbury Park was found. He was found right off the main peak but since he had fallen, he could not be seen from the top. I was involved in that search and once the chopper got involved they found him within a couple of hours.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Fri Jul 07, 2023 3:20 pm

yeah, it seems a bit odd that there are no family comments, or even facebook posts (i searched). there are definitely helicopters, and i even saw that they were also using a special plane with some sort of technology that they use for fires? that was in the AMR's instagram stories and is gone now, so i can't give specifics. but it sounded fancy. apparently no luck, though, as that was a few days ago.

the altadena sheriff’s station social media has been updating as well.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Fri Jul 07, 2023 10:48 pm

Post by **Uncle Rico** » Sat Jul 08, 2023 11:38 am

If that was his planned route, I wonder if he tried to check out the Saucer Branch and got into trouble. That drainage looks kind of gnarly.

AW~ · Post by **AW~** » Sat Jul 08, 2023 9:50 pm

Yeah, I guess......he's not close by. It was kind of a zoo today. SAR was at 9am...but it was cold and foggy before that.

' If anyone here followed the Bill Ewasko Joshua Tree story, there was one guy heavily involved in the 11 or 12 year search that really did walk just on the other side of some rocks from where hikers eventually found his remains
"
Totally different search capabilities. Air 5 plus LA fire...and as far as flushing out, drones were being used on firebreaks. now the the search is out of best leads. Amazingly there was somebody regular on every path though...Altadena Crest,
Lower Chaney trail, upper trail, El Prieto every 30 minutes, all the Sunset Ridge wherever, every 15? A lof of mt bikers there. Millard Falls every 5 min. Then there are the other lower ones..with more mtn bikers choosing their routes. There was 2 groups hiking to Sierra Saddle..and it was still early.

David R · Post by **David R** » Sat Jul 08, 2023 9:52 pm

I would bet money that he went up to Brown and then was planning to come down the steep break to the fire road. That section coming up is hard to get off track even though it is faint, coming down it is another story and if you haven't been up there I could see you going on a subsidiary ridge and dropping into brush and ultimately into those canyons that have waterfalls which are difficult if not impossible to scramble down. There is one clear ridge where you have to change directions to stay on the correct ridge right after Brown.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 9:54 am

i saw a comment on facebook by person married to someone in SAR that he was found deceased. no other details. i believe this was a few days ago when the helicopters (and the updates) stopped.

i’m sure they have their reasons, but i wonder why they wouldn’t update the public after updating us daily on the search?

Post by **Uncle Rico** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:02 pm

Wonder if foul play is suspected. That might explain sudden radio silence.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:12 pm

i wondered the same. or if it was purposeful on his end, even. still seems kind of weird that they wouldn't say his death was under investigation or whatnot.

David R · Post by **David R** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 1:33 pm

When you have radio silence and no comment, that means a suicide, unfortunately.

Post by **Sean** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 2:00 pm

David R wrote: ↑When you have radio silence and no comment, that means a suicide, unfortunately.

YouTube search: Albert Zisook
Keep scrolling down.
Let me know if you are fed any "interesting" videos.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:04 pm

after a bit of a dive, it seems there’s a psychiatrist called sidney zisook who specializes in depression and suicide prevention. i think that’s why those videos are popping up. that’s wild, though.

i am curious, is radio silence after suicide SAR protocol, or media protocol? or..?

the woman married into SAR said this to me, i just saw her comment:

“I was told that some hikers came across him. Volunteers have been thanked and helicopters paused. Story to come out shortly, I'm surprised it hasn't already.”

stonehillnews · Post by **stonehillnews** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 6:53 pm

I was part of the search planning section all week. As tempting as it is to speculate, I suggest just being patient until an official update can be posted. Hopefully it will be soon. The only reason there has been no official update yet is because there is no definitive conclusion. As soon as we can do so there will be some sort of public update about the status of the search. Hoping it will be this week.

David R · Post by **David R** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 7:25 pm

I found a suicide, that was unpleasant. He had cut himself on the neck and wrists. Just laying out there in the middle of a hiking trail and blood everywhere. He had just gone reported missing, once they knew it was a suicide they shut the media machine down. You need the coroner to sign off and make it official, in my case I didn't need a coroner to know what had happened.

stonehillnews · Post by **stonehillnews** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 7:40 pm

Well I do feel safe to say at minimum, what you described is not what happened here.

courtney · Post by **courtney** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 7:44 pm

stonehillnews wrote:I was part of the search planning section all week. As tempting as it is to speculate, I suggest just being patient until an official update can be posted. Hopefully it will be soon. The only reason there has been no official update yet is because there is no definitive conclusion. As soon as we can do so there will be some sort of public update about the status of the search. Hoping it will be this week.

thank you this and for your efforts!

Post by **Sean** » Wed Jul 12, 2023 8:51 pm

courtney wrote: ↑i am curious, is radio silence after suicide SAR protocol, or media protocol? or..?

There's a whole science devoted to reporting on suicide. You could google it and find websites and articles. I don't know what the various protocols are for various media and SAR groups. I'm sure it's a difficult situation to be in. Personally I don't like to speculate. But this was a public affair, so we should expect the public to speculate in the absence of solid information.

Gene · Post by **Gene** » Thu Jul 13, 2023 12:55 pm

On the topic of suicide, one of my sons and his buddy found the boys Father after he committed suicide. Needless to say, it left a mark on both boys. I knew the Father and was angry with him until I heard an explanation of suicide on NPR, Regardless of your politics, it's a great discussion.

Deconstructing 'Myths About Suicide'

There are many myths about suicide: that it's an act of selfishness, that it's cowardly, that it's just a cry for help.
Psychologist Thomas Joiner has studied suicide his entire professional life -- and says much of what we assume about suicide is wrong. In Myths About Suicide, Joiner explains why we have so many misconceptions about this heart-wrenching facet of human behavior.
With better understanding, Joiner says, we can do a better job of preventing suicide -- and supporting those it leaves behind.

FWIW, suicide is not a good idea, period.