EISPIRATEN

Its that time of year again, yipee. All day at work (big rock creek) constant gun shots below Mnt. Lewis/Pinyon Ridge. Makes me wonder if they aren't just shooting for the hell of it.

Have you hiked Mount Lewis and Pinyon Ridge? These are on my list to do, trying to figure the best way to get them both with the SR2 closed between Vincent Gap and Islip Saddle. Hopefully I will not get shot by some trigger happy hunter.

Two years ago I was on Islip and a week later on Pine Mt. in October - gunshots galore and a bunch of gunracks parked at the trailheads.

My bright orange bandanna was prominently on display to say the least. Also the last time I'll go hiking in that area during hunting season.

Travis wrote:Have you hiked Mount Lewis and Pinyon Ridge? These are on my list to do, trying to figure the best way to get them both with the SR2 closed between Vincent Gap and Islip Saddle.

I'm also wondering what the best way to do these is with the highway closure. Perhaps a bike and hike from either end of the closure.

Travis wrote:Have you hiked Mount Lewis and Pinyon Ridge? These are on my list to do, trying to figure the best way to get them both with the SR2 closed between Vincent Gap and Islip Saddle. Hopefully I will not get shot by some trigger happy hunter.

I know Pinyon has a dirt road going up to it that I've been on some time ago, its on the HPS site. Mount Lewis is best approached from Vincent's Gap, again there is a road up that too (also on the HPS site). Haven't done any really nice hiking routes up these.

Let's face it guys, hunting season is a relatively short period of time. I'm not a hunter, but I respect their right to legally persue their passion during that period.

We know when it's hunting season. Why complain about it every time?

Hikers don't have more of a right to the San Gabriels than hunters do. Especially during hunting season.

Got a problem with that - stop complaining and have the Govt change the laws. Probably won't happen. I don't think it should happen. I'm a hiker, but a strong believer that legal hunters have their rights too...

If you hear pops that frighten you, either accept them as hunters sharing your area legally, or go home and wait until after hunting season till you go back.

Not bad. 8)

As a sorta former hunter (don't really anymore, unfortunately), I can saw we aren't always the stereotype. I'm more of a shooter though. basic rules everyone should follow.

It's the vatos and wannabe gangsters you hafta watch out for, mostly at trailheads or any turnoff on the roads.

Good point Taco.. Shooters have rights too.. If you own a firearm that is licensed to you, you cannot legally discharge it in most of the cities in Southern California - other than in firing ranges which are expensive.

But especially during hunting season, the San Gabriels are a popular spot for shooters to set up a safe area and practice target shooting.

It's legal. I'm not even a shooter, but my suggestion to others would be "If the popping sounds made by people persuing their legal right to be in the San Gabriels during hunting season bother you - Go Home And Wait Until Hunting Season Is Over."

We're on the same page Taco...

For the life of me I can't find anywhere in this thread where anyone was complaining about hunters - all I see are comments about how they seem to go hunting during hunting season.

All is well on this front. If it came across as such, I apologise, as I will usually say something up front about shooters as they are often poorly represented when it comes to hiking and mountaineering. I always see shooters (good ones) getting the shaft in lots of situations, so I like to represent the good guys who don't shoot at somethign they can't really identify.

(I've been shot at too, I'm on your side!)

Carry on!

When does hunting season end?

HikeUp - For the life of me I can't figure out why you don't see your post on this thread and other posts as being completely transparant as far as your opinion towards hunters.. Yeah, you just noticed they were hunting during hunting season. Good reason for a thread, or adding your input to a thread.. "Yeah, I noticed they were hunting during hunting season",,

For the life of me - gimme a break.

I think it's clear there are hikers (including myself 2 years ago) that have no idea when hunting season is and where hunting is allowed. It's clear to me that this thread is about informing hikers that hunting is allowed in the same place as hiking. As my earlier post said - I no longer hike during hunting season - my choice.

Like Rob, I would also like to know when hunting season ends.

haha for my next thread "abortion - right or wrong"

http://www.dfg.ca.gov/

TacoDelRio wrote:http://www.dfg.ca.gov/

Sweet.

Janice wrote:... the San Gabriels are a popular spot for shooters to set up a safe area and practice target shooting. It's legal...

While hunting is definitely legal, I'm pretty sure target shooting is illegal in the the ANF.

Hunting season dates, as I read California web sites cited above, are complicated. It depends on zone, game, and weapon.

For example, SGW, SJW, and East & West San Gabriels are each in different deer zones (D11, D14, D15, & D19). Dates differ for deer, bighorn sheep, elk, and antelope. Dates for archers are different from other weapons.

While many hunting seasons end in October, a few run to Dec 31, 2007.

Do I read this correctly?

I bought a bright orange knit hat at WalMart for $3.96 -- a good investment, I figure, to add to my bright orange fleece pullover.

Yeah, I think you are reading it correctly. Good luck on figuring it all out.

Maybe I'll get one of those flags the kids have on the back of their bicycles, the ones that are a sort of whip antenna with an orange trianglular pennant on them. Or maybe that would draw fire? Yipes. I just hope those guys remember their hunter safety classes. Don't fire unless you've got a clear target with positive ID.

Hikin_Jim wrote:

Janice wrote:... the San Gabriels are a popular spot for shooters to set up a safe area and practice target shooting. It's legal...

While hunting is definitely legal, I'm pretty sure target shooting is illegal in the the ANF.

TO my knowledge, it is. I don't recall what the figure was, but I think discharging a firearm within something to the order of 500ft (dunno why they'd use Imperial, insted of Metric, hence furhter confusion) of a road is illegal.

Burro Canyon, Angeles something (dunno, buddies go there), and some place in Palmdale are the only San Gabriel shooting areas to my knowledge.

Jim, from a hunter's point of view, as long as you aren't colored like a deer and you talk while breaking bush, you should be fine. I've come across hunters in the mountains before, and I just make an audible noise for them to notice me, while trying to interfere with their hunt as little as possible. (Usually end up swapping info on firearms and areas anyway)

Rule #2 is don't piss off the guy with the gun if you're unarmed.

TacoDelRio wrote:Rule #2 is don't piss off the guy with the gun if you're unarmed.

Yeah, for real. I remember reading a newspaper article about an environmentalist attacking a hunter with a ski pole. Gun? Ski pole? In the rock-paper-scissors scheme of the world I think a gun beats a ski pole; don't you?

I'm new here so please excuse me If I step on any toes. First of all as a Hunter and Mountaineer I can appreciate both forms of enjoyment.

Hunting is allowed in the national forests so outside of getting the laws changed expect to see hunters when you are hiking especially during deer and upland game seasons. Hunters appreciate seeing game animals just as much as you do, and every responsible ethical hunter I have ever met doesn't shoot at everything that moves.

Secondly if a hunter is up on a ridge or saddle and "glassing" for game. Do what you can not to surprise him or the game. He spent just as much time if not more climbing up there and really doesn't want his hunt ruined by a bunch of loud talking bell's on the boots wearing people.

Also please keep in mind anyone who has visions of disrupting someone who is hunting. That it is a federal offense to do so, and if it were me I would press charges if you intentionally spooked the game, I was after in order to prevent it from ending up in my freezer.

As someone that backpacks and hunts, "can't be all just get along"?

Michael

Mntngoat wrote:"can't we all just get along?"

Well said, friend, well said.

Mntngoat wrote:Secondly if a hunter is up on a ridge or saddle and "glassing" for game. Do what you can not to surprise him or the game. He spent just as much time if not more climbing up there and really doesn't want his hunt ruined by a bunch of loud talking bell's on the boots wearing people.

2 years ago when I was on the top of Pine Mt. I could see several hunters on the "other devil's backbone". I made myself visible and descended as quietly as I could. We had a quiet conversation about any game sightings and I went on my way back to Blue Ridge. Ran across a couple more hunters who clearly indicated to me that they saw me and were appreciative of my attempts at being quiet. And I was appreciative of them letting me know they saw me.

Back to the target shooting in the Angeles National Forest during hunting season question - is it legal or illegal?

I have many friends who practice target shooting in the ANF. They are responsible, hopefully law abiding gun owners who can't discharge their firearms in the city.

I asked them if they knew for certain that it was legal to set up a safe practice shooting site in the ANF.

None of them were sure. After hearing what some members of this board had to say - mostly they weren't sure either, but they thought it might be illegal, I actually sent an e-mail to the Caliornia Fish and Game site that Taco posted a link to.

They have a "contact us" part of the site where you can enter your e-mail address, ask a question, and they claim you should expect a response between 2 and 3 days from your e-mail.

Well guys, that was way more than 2 or 3 days ago that i sent the e-mail. Maybe they are as confused about the answer to the the question as we
are.

BTW - I spent some time searching through some of their regulation books that they offer online copies of - and I couldn't find any answer to my question there also.

My hunting buddies are more or less divided 50/50. Some of them insist it has to be legal because setting up a controlled area for target shooting has to be much safer than just going out in the wild and shooting at something you hope is game.

Others say that while target shooting might be safer for everybody concerned, hunting is the only allowed discharge of firearms in the ANF.

If I ever get an answer (which right about now I'm thinking might not happen for whatever reason) I'll be happy to share it with you guys and gals.

Janice McIntyre

Thanks, Janice, I'd be curious to know the answer. I'm going to be out this weekend in the ANF. I may stop in at the Grassy Hollow Visitor Center and ask one of the rangers; perhaps they won't wait 2 - 3 days when asked in person.

Hikin_Jim - please watch their respone to your question. Most of the Ranger Stations this time of year are staffed by either rookies, or other staff that are qualified to answer only the "easy" questions. I bet the person you ask the question to won't have an immediate answer, will have to spend some time finding out the real anwer from a "superior". Which might take some time - maybe 1 or 2 days - If I'm wrong, let me know.

I have nothing against the Rangers in our San Gabriels. I love them and think they are doing a great job.

Overworked some maybe...

Hi Everyone,

Actually, the restrictions regarding the discharge of firearms within the Angeles National Forest and the Inyo National Forest are clearly posted on many trail head and campground information boards/placards (official postings). The legal restrictions are also included in many of the printed hand-outs issued with wilderness permits and National Forest information hand-outs. The usual legal statement reads as follows in the Angeles and Inyo National Forst informational postings (taken from two examples I have in hand):

"The following acts are prohibited:......"Discharging a firearm, except for emergencies and the taking of game as permitted by State game laws."

Further restrictions included in some publications/postings include statements of minimum distance from roads, trails and campsites/dwellings (500 ft. seems very familiar) - also prohibited to fire across roads & water. All of these secondary restrictions apply whether or not a person is engaging in the legal taking of game.

Suffice it to say that target shooting is in fact illegal in our local National Forests except in established formal firing ranges. This is unfortunate since we lost one of the more convenient public venues for target shooting when it was closed several years ago reportedly due to the extreme trash problem and the fact that many people were engaging in dangerous and sustained rapid fire marathons with military weapons such as Ak's, SKS's, M1's, etc. using full metal jacket rounds (the Kentucky Range just south of Palmdale on Angeles Forest Highway - only the private Kentucky Rifle Club remains).

I am an avid hunter (mostly small game/game birds) and fisherman (when I cut a slice of time from my mountaineering & hiking schedule), but I must say that I have at times felt uncomfortable (fear really) when I find myself in close proximity to some of the deer hunters I run into out in the San Gabriels. Just this morning, I saw a person obviously hunting up on the Kratka Ridge near Mt. Waterman. The wind was strong enough to pick up 1/2" diameter pebbles from the ground on the ridge crest and fire them off into the forest (at least 60 mph). Hunting in those conditions on the ridge crest was fruitless, and brings me to distrust anyone who engages in such hunting practices. This is why I put in for deer tags no further south than the southern Sierra here in California. Please be extra aware during the deer hunting season in our local mountains.

Climb Hard, Climb Safe

Doug Forbes

Thanks Doug. That is a very thorough answer to a question I never got a response from by the CA Fish and Game site.

I will pass this info on to my friends who are hunter/target shooters. Amazing that I never read the fine print, nor did they. Thanks for pointing this out.

I stand corrected - target shooting is not legal in the ANF.

Doug Forbes wrote:The following acts are prohibited: ... Discharging a firearm, except for emergencies and the taking of game as permitted by State game laws

OK, that rings a bell. I believe I have seen that somewhere before. Thanks for the clarification.

I was over in the Prairie Fork/Vincent Gulch/Mine Gulch/E Fork area yesterday. Heard a lot of shots. Thank you all for posting that it was hunting season. Nice to know what's going on ahead of time; otherwise kind of freaky.

Encountered one hunter down in Vincent Gulch. Odd that he didn't have any supplies. I didn't even see a canteen let alone a backpack. It's always puzzled me why there isn't more cross over in terms of gear and equipment between hikers and hunters. Seems like the 10 essentials, particularly water in S. Calif, would be something that everyone who ventures into the outdoors would want to carry.

Speaking of cross over in terms of gear and equipment, maybe I'll have to get me a nice bright orange something or another for this time of year ... the only person I want to call me "deer" is my fiancee.