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Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2011 11:44 am
by Slowest_Hiker
Any rodentia experts? This little guy was hopping around at Valley Forge CG this Saturday.

Image
kangaroo_rodent by moore91024, on Flickr

It was small, perhaps 2 inches body and a long tail. Its cheeks were stuffed. It walked around, including up the trunk of this tree a ways, but also sprung on its jumping legs.

From a little googling, the four toes suggest a Merriam's kangaroo rat, but the habitat and range don't seem quite right. Any help?

Thanks!

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:41 pm
by cougarmagic
I'm not a rodent expert by any means, but I would guess it's neotoma fuscipes - the packrat.

http://sibr.com/mammals/M127.html

He's cute!

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 7:50 pm
by Mike P
Like CM, not a rodent expert, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night...

My first guess was some sort of Perognathus (pocket mouse) or possibly a Peromyscus (deer mouse-type). Could still be a Neotoma of some sort, though. I wouldn't bet my lunch money on it.
However, I would bet that this individual is not a k-rat.( K-rats are way cuter... :) )

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 10:56 am
by Slowest_Hiker
Hey, thanks for looking! I checked out all the suggestions. He was cute, and conveniently, it looks like he posed so that I'd know he had 4 hind toes!

pocket mouse - has 5 hind toes
http://sierrafoothillgarden.files.wordp ... rnicus.jpg

deer mouse - 5 hind toes
http://www.bear-tracker.com/deermous.html

pack rat - 5 hind toes (think it's too large, also)
http://www.discoverlife.org/mp/20q?go=h ... _id%3D1389

The four hind toes keeps leading me to dipodomys merriami, but they seem to be a bit south or east of Valley Forge. Maybe he caught a ride in a PCT hiker's backpack (!) or a ranger's truck? Or fires have altered their range, or ...?

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 11:36 am
by HikeUp
Oh jeez. Looks like we're gonna have to go back to countin' school. Ok everybody, take your shoes n socks off...

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 3:45 pm
by Mike P
Still not going with Dipodomys of any species. That guy or gal does not have a k-rat look: Merriam's Kangaroo Rat

or try this picture:
Image

But, hey, this would not be the first time I have been wrong...

Interesting discussion...

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:02 pm
by cougarmagic
I was just at a tracking class today - where I was told "all rodents have four toes in front, 5 toes in back" (in reference to the toes you'll see in the prints - in reality, rabbits have a fifth toe in front that you'll rarely see in the track - but I digress)

But in any case - Feivel here has five toes in the back - you just can't see the small inner fifth toe in your photo. (HikeUp is right!) I still don't know what he is, but I think we can cross off K-rat based on Mike's photo - they have the tassel on their tails, and this one doesn't.

(If rodent toes don't seem exciting enough, I also learned to ID bullfrog poop. 8) :lol: )

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:50 am
by Mike P
cougarmagic wrote: I was just at a tracking class today
Where was the class? What a great opportunity.
- where I was told "all rodents have four toes in front, 5 toes in back" (in reference to the toes you'll see in the prints - in reality, rabbits have a fifth toe in front that you'll rarely see in the track - but I digress)
Yes, but rabbits (and pikas and hares) aren't rodents. They are lagomorphs. Could that explain the different front toe count ??
(If rodent toes don't seem exciting enough, I also learned to ID bullfrog poop. 8) :lol: )
Ohhh! Now, I am officially jealous! 8)

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 7:41 pm
by cougarmagic
Where was the class? What a great opportunity
It was taught by Dick Newell, and it was at Irvine Ranch regional park. The website (with tons of great information, and photos) is here:

http://octrackers.com/

It's primarily for rangers, biologists, and docents but I begged and pleaded my way in. I guess he liked my blog.
Yes, but rabbits (and pikas and hares) aren't rodents. They are lagomorphs. Could that explain the different front toe count ??
Indeed! In fact I screwed that up. Here is the real deal: http://www.octrackers.com/analyzingthetrack.htm

"Dogs, cats and rabbits * are 4 X 4's - Rodents including squirrels are 4 X 5's - All others are 5 X 5's (*While this animal is usually thought of as having four digits front and back, in reality there is a fifth digit* on the inside of the front foot that will show under some conditions. )"

Re: Kangaroo rat or mouse ID help?

Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 10:30 pm
by HikeUp
Dewclaw?