EISPIRATEN

Time to move forward and rebuild the San Gabriel Mountains.

Please offer up ideas, volunteer opportunities, events, etc. for people to contribute to the rebuilding and recovery efforts following the Station Fire.

No finger pointing allowed.

Personally I'm interested in trail building, restoration and repair. Where do I go to get involved, etc. In particular, are there old, long forgotten trails that can be re-discovered because they have now been uncovered?

HikeUp wrote:Time to move forward and rebuild the San Gabriel Mountains.

Please offer up ideas, volunteer opportunities, events, etc. for people to contribute to the rebuilding and recovery efforts following the Station Fire.

No finger pointing allowed.

Personally I'm interested in trail building, restoration and repair. Where do I go to get involved, etc. In particular, are there old, long forgotten trails that can be re-discovered because they have now been uncovered?

I imagine a few missing persons cases will be solved. Cars over the side, missing planes and what not.

The plants & animals should recover in time. If you go back next year about this time you'll probably see quite a bit of regrown vegetation; give it two years and and it'll look pretty normal (except for trees).

Human improvements (campgrounds, picnic areas and the like) might be a bigger issue, but that'll be due to Federal budget issues. Might want to call the ANF headquaters later this year after the drama dies down to find out if there are any organizations doing volunteer rebuilding.

If all the talk about "El Nino" weather returning this winter is true, then trail building should wait until next year. Once the heavy downpours hit the the barren slopes, erosion is going to hit those mountains like the sun melting an ice cream cone. I suspect the roads are going to experience major washouts also.

Im hoping people will start to think about what trails should be eliminated.
But for trail repair, I think our current structure of volunteer organizations is excellent...we just need to concentrate together across the multi-use spectrum on getting accomplishments done and work a trail until its completed.

We could give any volunteer a one year adventure pass for even a few hours work...ongoing volunteers would be given a lifetime pass.

Initially it would be the front range trails like Gabrelino...trails that dont require Hwy2 or the other roads. With the right amount of planning, we can avoid being setback by the winter storms...the main thing is do we have the tools(paid for by the forest service) and the people?

Also, the forest service should change those conservation core workers from Bear Creek/East Fork over to the western side.

Link to San Gabriel Mountains Trailbuilders (SGMTB)...

http://www.sgmtrailbuilders.org/

The central link to volunteerism is
http://www.mtlowe.net/VolunteerNews.htm

Does one have to get permission to do trail work? Or can you just hike in with a shovel and get to it?

as linked to by lakenyon previously, here's a whole bunch of old topo maps with old trails on them

http://www.alexandria.ucsb.edu/6min_los_angeles_county/

ridge route from bear canyon to mount deception, interesting...

A quick search online pointed to these links about trail construction...

1) FHA's (yes, the Federal Highway Administration!) Trail Construction and Maintenance Notebook

2) Tennessee Department of Environment and Conservation's Pathways to Trail Building (link is to a pdf file)

DamOTclese wrote:For example, if you restore a trail and the grade you end up with is 14% incline, an organized group will have instructions on reworking what you did to make it 6% or less -- loonger but less of a grade for that trail.

6 freaking % ?!!! that's nothing.

there should be 2 trails in all areas that can be combined for a loop. 20% for the uphill, and 10% for the downhill

Zé wrote:...20% for the uphill, and 10% for the downhill

That's what ridges are for!

FHA uses a max. 10% rule it seems (528 feet per mile). Seems like a lot of trails leading to peaks in the San Gabriel's are between 500' and 1000' per mile. (fire roads seem to be at about 400-500'/mile on ave. Generalizing of course.

HikeUp wrote: That's what ridges are for!

Yes, but trails are simply for approaching canyons and should be designed as such 8) ..if someone actually wants to bag a peak(?), they should have to work for it...unless of course ,said peak leads to canyon.

HikeUp wrote:Does one have to get permission to do trail work? Or can you just hike in with a shovel and get to it?

I always do.

Rangers in the San Gabs backcountry are so few and far between (I've now seen exactly 1 in 40+ years of hiking), that it's pretty much regulation free. If you do trail maintenance in obscure places, no one will ever know.

Hikin_Jim wrote:

HikeUp wrote:Does one have to get permission to do trail work? Or can you just hike in with a shovel and get to it?

I always do.

Who do you get permission from and how?

AW wrote:

HikeUp wrote: That's what ridges are for!

Yes, but trails are simply for approaching canyons and should be designed as such 8) ..if someone actually wants to bag a peak(?), they should have to work for it...unless of course ,said peak leads to canyon.

DamOTclese wrote: The Pacific Coast Trail might be different, now that I think of it. It may be against the rules for people to alter and maintain trails along the PCT since it seems to me that the pCT is treated differently than anything else.

It is known as the Pacific Crest National Scenic Trail More commonly referred to as the "PCT"

The PCT has the same specifications as all other trails that are for hikers and equestrians

So it may seem different but that is probably because it is for Hikers & Equestrians... for the most part the San Gabriel trails are designed and laid out for hikers

18-24" wide tread. 5% average grade with short segments of up to 15%

Brush clearance 2 feet on the downhill side 4 feet on the uphill side 8-10ft overhead

As far as "altering" the trail I guess that all depends on what you mean by "altering" it

Your not altering it to trim the brush and restore the tread to original specifications

If you mean by "Altering" your are "Re-Aligning", or "Re-Routing", THAT is a major NO-NO on the PCT or really anywhere else

At times the PCTA trail crews have taken a lot of heat from people who saw we are cutting back the brush too far. First off I say if you want it tripped a certain way come on out and do it the way you want it.

Secondly the PCTA is generally an unpaid contractor for the Forest Service and we are required to trim it the way the Forest Service wants it. They are supplied with fuel, insurance, various expendable supplies for the food for the crews etc.

Matt

i have done trailwork with the Santa Monica Mountains Conservacy, Concerned Off Road Bicyclists Assoc., the Conejo Open Space Conservation Agency (all in the Santa Monica Range) and with Friend's of the Inyo in the eastern Sierra. they have all supplied the tools and lunch for the workers. FOTI supplied dinner too!

surely, there must be an entity for the SG's??? we need to Google that and let the agencies know about this board, so they can send out info to those interested in volunteering. i know i would be.

the fires are always a bitter event for those who love the outdoors, but a nice "sweet" after the rampage is the amazing wildflowers the next spring.

AW wrote:

HikeUp wrote: That's what ridges are for!

Yes, but trails are simply for approaching canyons and should be designed as such 8) ..if someone actually wants to bag a peak(?), they should have to work for it...unless of course ,said peak leads to canyon.

I vote for this. 8)

HikeUp wrote:Time to move forward and rebuild the San Gabriel Mountains.

Please offer up ideas, volunteer opportunities, events, etc. for people to contribute to the rebuilding and recovery efforts following the Station Fire.

Volunteer Coordinator for the Angeles National Forest is Howard Okamoto: [url="mailto:hokamoto@fs.fed.us"]hokamoto@fs.fed.us

PackerGreg wrote:Volunteer Coordinator for the Angeles National Forest is Howard Okamoto: [url="mailto:hokamoto@fs.fed.us"]hokamoto@fs.fed.us

Thanks.

Other sources of information on volunteer opportunities.

http://www.modernhiker.com/2009/09/11/h ... al-forest/

https://eispiraten.com/viewtopic.php?t=1958

which also links to... http://www.crystallake.name/twork/hotodoit.htm

HikeUp wrote:

Hikin_Jim wrote:

HikeUp wrote:Or can you just hike in with a shovel and get to it?

I always do.

Who do you get permission from and how?

No, I mean I just get to it. I'll take my clippers or a shovel or whatever when I go on hikes near home and do a little maintenance on bad spots. Haven't built any new stuff, just doing the most basic maintenance.

Hikin_Jim wrote:No, I mean I just get to it.

Doh!. Got it. Thanks!