EISPIRATEN

6 venomous-
Southern pacific rattlesnake (Crotalus helleri)
Western diamondback rattlesnake (Crotalus atrox)
Southwestern speckled rattlesnake (Crotalus mitchelli pyrrhus)

see http://lomalindahealth.org/medical-cent ... index.html for the other 3 ones.

Websites for bites:
http://lomalindahealth.org/medical-cent ... trike.html
http://www.calpoison.com/public/snakebite.html
http://www.ci.glendale.ca.us/planning/p ... _Other.pdf (page 15 of 27)

Vacinations for dogs:
http://www.redrockbiologics.com/

Latest News:
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/unleash ... e-bit.html
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/stat ... bites.html
"Scientists and toxicologists can take guesses at what's behind the spike in extreme symptoms, but no one yet knows what's going on. Some say it could be a change in snake venom, a change in the snakes themselves, or something altogether different.
“This is a brand new phenomenon,” said Jeffrey Brent, clinical professor of medicine at the University of Colorado Health Sciences Center. “It should spur a considerable amount of research in the area.”

Summary:
I was surprised to see how effective these venoms are...and expensive to treat...just one vial of Cro-Fab(modern sheep antidote) runs $700 per...and there could be anywhere from 10-30 of those vials used. Luckily there arent many bites...with about 50 each year from SoCal. Compare that to Lyme disease from ticks, running twice that amount or more. It didnt look like there was an agreed upon guide, but as I see it heres the issues of a rattlesnake bite:

1) Reaction- Seems stepping on these guys and quickly going somewhere helps considering a snakes 1/3 striking distance and need of on target venom injection.
2) See if one is actually injected - effects should happen rather quickly
3) Medical help - ..slow walking is not lethal and if it saves time its a plus. All articles stated the importance of the group being calm. Seems part of being calm is knowing the effects that will progress...swelling,sharp pain,etc...and if its in the San Gabriels, not to worry about type A venom(Mojave rattlesnake-neurological effects) even though apparently the Southern Pacific rattlesnake bite can emulate that.
4) hydrated with water-that could mean drinking it or not...who knows...
5) time of day - what happens if you get bite at night?

One of the articles mentions waking up at camp and finding a snake coiled next to your head or reaching up on a ledge and grabbing snake...but any close experience seems to be very rare.

canyoneering discussion of snake bites:
http://www.bogley.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11318
trip report:
http://www.math.utah.edu/~sfolias/canyo ... =snakebite

Anyways, seems better to have a thread just for snakes...

Also added a link to a video re: SG snakes in general...almost 10 mins in length.

There is also snake avoidance training for dogs.
Patrick Callahan is one name I've heard of; with training often in Norco.

They basically use a defanged rattler with a shock collar on your dog.
If/when the dog approaches the rattler (I believe they make them interact) it gets a big shock. They repeat until the dog won't go near it.
Needs to be redone annually or so.

I haven't had it done, but have heard of it.

$70 or so methinks

I freely acknowledge some level of fool's paradise regarding these beautiful critters, but I've always found them to be rather docile, even when surprised. The first one and I surprised each other a little south of Mine Gulch. He / she / it stayed-put non-aggressively, long enough for me to get a few pictures. The second one (towards the left, up on its coils) rattled as I passed on a possibly closed trail near Coldbrook. It's my OPINION that healthy respect and common sense are possibly the best things to have regarding Crotalus.

Hey AW-

Thanks for the good links. The six listed rattlesnakes are those found in ALL of southern California. In the San Gabriel range proper one will find only the Southern Pacific Rattlesnake. Just gotta' be careful around them...

Elwood wrote:The second one (towards the left, up on its coils) rattled as I passed on a possibly closed trail near Coldbrook.

I don't see a damn thing I'm doomed!

Thanks for the good links, AW.

Rumpled wrote:There is also snake avoidance training for dogs.
Patrick Callahan is one name I've heard of; with training often in Norco.

I took my dog to Callahan several years ago. I still have a mixed opinion about it. One the one had, the training clearly worked, instantly. They like to train the dog to be averse to the sight, scent, and sound of the rattler, independently. The first step is to lead the dog up to the snake which is coiled on the ground - the dog takes a good sniff and gets a shock. After that one, my dog would not even look at the next one, which was hidden under a garbage can. She was over ten feet away from it, and wanted nothing to do with it.

ON THE OTHER HAND....in seven years of hiking with her at least once a week, we have seen all of two rattlesnakes, both of which simply rolled off the trail into the brush as we approached. And now, my dog mysteriously balks sometimes and will not go past a certain point on a trail (I have to assume she is smelling a snake, which is never anywhere to be seen - it could have been there the day before, for all I know). She will not move, and is clearly frightened.

I am leaning toward the idea that a 6 foot leash is probably the better (and more humane) investment....

HikeUp wrote:

Elwood wrote:The second one (towards the left, up on its coils) rattled as I passed on a possibly closed trail near Coldbrook.

I don't see a damn thing I'm doomed!

I'm with HikeUp. That is one well hidden snake.

Hikin_Jim wrote:

HikeUp wrote:

Elwood wrote:The second one (towards the left, up on its coils) rattled as I passed on a possibly closed trail near Coldbrook.

I don't see a damn thing I'm doomed!

I'm with HikeUp. That is one well hidden snake.

Find Waldo the Snake.

HikeUp wrote:

Hikin_Jim wrote:

HikeUp wrote:I don't see a damn thing I'm doomed!

I'm with HikeUp. That is one well hidden snake.

Find Waldo the Snake.

How do you drive hikers crazy? Post a photo with nothing in it and tell them there's a rattlesnake.

Mea culpa. I scaled the original 4K x 3K image to 640 x 480, leaving our fanged friend hard to spot. Here it is, blown up.

I, too, thought you were scamming us -- in order to have the mountains all to yerself!

The one was pointed at the trail ~ 1230 PST, Today

Elwood wrote:The one was pointed at the trail ~ 1230 PST, Today

You're a snake magnet!

The snake is in the middle of the bush on the left, it's black and it's looking for victims - he redid the picture somewhere on this blog?