Marmot PreCip Jacket is FAIL

Post by **Hikin_Jim** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:46 pm

If you're thinking about getting a Marmot PreCip jacket -- don't. They're advertised as "waterproof" raingear. NOT! In reality, they are a somewhat water resistant windbreaker. I went out for a 90 minute walk a couple of weeks ago in drizzle, not light rain, drizzle, and the coat soaked through in multiple places. FAIL.

EnFuego · Post by **EnFuego** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 9:03 pm

You went out a couple weeks ago and just now posting? WTF!

Thanks for the 411.

AlanK · Post by **AlanK** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 9:43 pm

I've had good luck with miine, but it's several years old.

yoskolo · Post by **yoskolo** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 9:59 pm

Here's a question for you...
Did you wear the jacket with a layer underneath, keeping it separate from your skin? The oil in your skin will defeat the waterproof membrane in fabrics like Event, Hyvent, Precip, etc.
I've worn my North Face lightweight shell in a pinch over a t-shirt and had poor luck. Water just sort of soaks through at the arms and neck. But put it over a long-sleeved-shirt and you're good forever. It's a little weird actually.

Rick Kent · Post by **Rick Kent** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:39 am

Like Alan, I've had good luck with mine too but it also is an older model. I haven't used it in that much rain though.

Post by **Hikin_Jim** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:06 pm

EnFuego wrote:You went out a couple weeks ago and just now posting? WTF!

Ze wif, she eez pregnant, und ze work is very bizee.

yoskolo wrote:Here's a question for you...
Did you wear the jacket with a layer underneath, keeping it separate from your skin? The oil in your skin will defeat the waterproof membrane in fabrics like Event, Hyvent, Precip, etc.
I've worn my North Face lightweight shell in a pinch over a t-shirt and had poor luck. Water just sort of soaks through at the arms and neck. But put it over a long-sleeved-shirt and you're good forever. It's a little weird actually.

Very true. I've been aware for some time about dirt, skin oils, etc. compromising waterproof, breathable barriers. I consistently wear a long sleeve, collared shirt (or turtle neck) and a hat of some type specifically for that reason.

Rick Kent wrote:
AlanK wrote:I've had good luck with mine, but it's several years old.
Like Alan, I've had good luck with mine too but it also is an older model. I haven't used it in that much rain though.

I've had good results in wind and intermittent rain. It's when I was continuously in a steady drizzle that it completely failed.

The site where I purchased the jacket (backcountry.com) has a lot of positive reviews -- but also a lot of reviews just like mine. Below are some of the bad reviews. There are several more reviews I didn't include that indicate that the jacket soaks through where your pack straps go over your shoulders.

Personally the PreCip is a good jacket if you are looking for a jacket you can take on day trips or just carry in your car or backpack in case it starts to rain. However, if you are looking for a jacket to wear in any sustained precipitation then save your money because this jacket saturates easily.

I choose the Precip because of all of its great reviews, best of status, and Backpackers Editors choice award. I have owned it for a little of a year now and it has mostly lived up to all its hype, at least in its casual and recreational use. (i.e. around town and the thunderstorm) However, last week on a small 2 hr day hike in the Quinault Rain Forest it became quickly clammy and began soak through on the arms and chest. Needless to say, I was little disappointed. Bottom line the Precip is good for light and/or small rain showers not, heavy or prolonged periods of rain. Mine is going in my truck to wear around town.

i'm displeased w/ this rain jacket. i bought it as a lightweight rain jacket and needed one w/ pitzips. soooo many hikers swear by this jacket but i don't know why. after a few months the sleeves have become absolutely useless. they get soaked through in 5 minutes of even light rain. the waist is also starting to wet out at a very fast rate. i wouldn't count on this jacket when staying dry really matters. i have to give credit to marmot though. i called and explained my situation and they said to send the jacket in. i'm planning on doing that soon so we'll see what they do about it...

the first day in a downpour i was soaked within 20 minutes. this jacket may be o.k. in light rainfall, but it is too light for a serious storm here in montana.

I have a precip that came with the now discontinued Thunder Ridge. This jacket can't keep you dry from the parking lot to the grocery store. It guzzles Nik Wax to no effect.

Seemed nice enough: pit zips, new collar design, cuffs and windproof is great. First rain (Portland, OK?) the hood leaked at the brim and back. I got it for Christmas. Here we are in April. The DWR is now shot, and the fabric now soaks in the rain.

I bought this because I knew I would need rain gear. It had gotten numerous positive reviews so I was fairly sure that it would work well. I turned out to be wrong. This jacket works okay in very light rain, but then again so does a windbreaker or a t-shirt. I took a ten minute walk in moderate rain, under trees most of the time and by the time I got to my destination the jacket was soaked through at the shoulders and the arms. In its favor it does breathe very well but I would rather have it shed water worth a crap.

I bought this jacket in December and it served me nicely through the winter. But in the spring I discovered that it is not waterproof at all. After first small rain I got all wet.

I too was lured to this jacket by the tiny pack size, low weight, and very reasonable price. Seemed too good to be true. Well, it is. This jacket will protect you from minor storms at best (when new). I have one that is 3 months old, basically sitting in my pack until the snows came, very little to no wear. Well, this week the snow came in hard during a night hike. Wet, heavy stuff that falls fast and melts on you just as fast. "No Problem", I figure as I zip on my PreCip. Within 15 minutes of heavy, wet snow (about an inch on our pack covers), the shoulders and hood were totally wet out, and leaking badly. Skip this for anything but casual, summer use. You can't afford to be in the winter backcountry with an inferior, leaking shell such as this!

Rick Kent · Post by **Rick Kent** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 6:56 pm

My Precip is starting to get worn out and soon I'll have to replace it. Let me know if you come across anything else around 12oz in weight and $100 price. I'm sure there probably are a few other options but I haven't really started looking around yet.

Post by **Hikin_Jim** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 10:15 am

I keep hearing about Frogg Toggs which have a reputation for being good in rain and for being lightweight, but also to not hold up for a long time. I suppose if they're cheap enough, it wouldn't be too bad to just periodically replace them.

AW~ · Post by **AW~** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 2:26 pm

Personally, I would be upset if a $100 jacket failed like that. I understand its all advertising and people really want to buy the image/brand, but certainly would feel no sorrow if this company or any other of these 'brands only' were to fold. Its gotten to the point where almost everyone plays up the brand and one has to rumage through the garbage of business ads to find clothes or anything that are actually made for the outdoors.

Post by **Hikin_Jim** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 5:15 pm

AW wrote:Personally, I would be upset if a $100 jacket failed like that. I understand its all advertising and people really want to buy the image/brand, but certainly would feel no sorrow if this company or any other of these 'brands only' were to fold. Its gotten to the point where almost everyone plays up the brand and one has to rumage through the garbage of business ads to find clothes or anything that are actually made for the outdoors.

It was really easy for me to find a lot of negative reviews. Also, I posted on some of the local boards here in S. Calif, and a couple of people shared that they've had the same issues. If it's that easy to find negative experiences -- really negative experiences -- then a lot of Marmot Precips are failing. The fact that Marmot continues to market them as "waterproof" raingear suitable for a "week long backpacking trip" seems highly irresponsible. I don't wish failure on any company, but I sure would like to see them either correct the problem or suffer some sort of economic consequences.

friendowl · Post by **friendowl** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 5:37 pm

my precip has never let me down yet......it is true about wearing a layer under....i stay dry on the inside all the time.....i feel like it is a great jacket

when i first bought my precip i wore it in the shower to see if it was waterproof.....it was..i was impressed...i wonder what went wrong with yours

Post by **Hikin_Jim** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:18 pm

friendowl wrote:my precip has never let me down yet......it is true about wearing a layer under....i stay dry on the inside all the time.....i feel like it is a great jacket

when i first bought my precip i wore it in the shower to see if it was waterproof.....it was..i was impressed...i wonder what went wrong with yours

Yep, it seems like I got one of the bad ones.

I found this interesting chart (below). It shows that Marmot PreCip is only half as waterproof as eVent. Interestingly, eVent is slightly more waterproof than GoreTex, but GoreTex is slightly more breathable than eVent. It also shows two layer GoreTex as having the same breathability as three layer GoreTex. Unfortunately, the table doesn't include Patagonia's H2No or NorthFace's HyVent which would have been very interesting for comparative purposes. Maybe I can look them up somewhere.

Code: Select all

Examples of Waterproof Breathability Ratings for Major Manufacturers

Brand           Fabric              Waterproofness   Breathability 
                                    (mm/24 hours)    (g/m2/24 hours) 
Columbia        Omni-Tech® (Adults)   10,000           10,000 
Columbia        Omni-Tech® (Kids)      6,000            6,000 
eVent           eVent                 30,000           22,000 
Gore-Tex®       PacLite®              28,000           15,000 
Gore-Tex®       Pro-Shell 2-Layer     28,000           25,000 
Gore-Tex®       Pro-Shell 3-Layer     28,000           25,000 
Lowe Alpine     Triplepoint® 3-Layer  20,000           20,000 
Marmot          MemBrain®             20,000           25,000 
Marmot          PreCip®               15,000           12,000 
Marmot          PreCip Plus®          25,000           15,000 
Mtn Hardwear    Conduit               20,000           20,000 
Sierra Designs  Hurricane              8,000            2,000 
Sierra Designs  Microlight               600              N/A

AW~ · Post by **AW~** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 4:29 pm

Here is some links

http://www.verber.com/mark/outdoors/gea ... bility.pdf

ehaustive:
http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover/ftp/Cloth ... erials.pdf

Note: its just a scale of waterproof test. None of these materials are really waterproof, although Goretex Ocean Tech like MPX would be on the edge...basically we are talking drysuit at this point.

I wear Nomex IIIA, which is just water-resistant, but does well. Big dog material, leave the precip in the small dog area so they arent comparable. Now if only there was an inexpensive pants that could perform well

yoskolo · Post by **yoskolo** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:05 pm

Anyone have experience with sil-nylon shells? Seems like that would be the lightest, most compact option. That stuff is pretty darn waterproof, though I can't guess at its durability and breathability.