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All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:58 pm
by HikeUp
Scat in your face

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29409988/
Wolves (and dogs) are in-your-face poopers
Scat locations maximize visual impact and odor distribution, study reveals

AP file
Research conducted here found that wolves are very strategic about where they deposit their scat. They select plants that maximize the visual impact and odor distribution of their feces.

Wolves do not do their business in any old place, but they instead choose locations that maximize visual impact and odor distribution, according to a new study that may also help to explain why dogs frequently relieve themselves on fire hydrants and other prominent urban landscape features.

The study is the first to examine the physical characteristics of substrates that wild wolves choose for what is called "fecal marking," when an individual's feces can provide information to others about territory control, identity, mating status, foraging efficiency and more.

While feces odor dispersal via wind appears to be a factor, author Isabel Barja told Discovery News, "The results of the study indicate that in wolves, visual aspects govern the choice of plants for fecal marking."

Barja, an Autonomous University of Madrid zoologist, inspected wolf scat in a mountainous region of Spain's northwest Iberian Peninsula. The area is occupied by at least two Iberian wolf packs containing nine to 10 individuals and multiple lone wolves.

During the study, 101 wolf scats were identified on plants, with 74.8 percent of them placed on conspicuous substrates, indicating they served a marking function. Computer analysis of these choices revealed that plant selection by wolves was not random, with the wily animals consistently defecating on plants of a certain diameter, height and species.

Barja said that, "the wolves select positively only poplar-leaved rock rose, Spanish white broom and maritime pine for fecal marking." These are plants that can match wolf heights and also that "stood out against the homogeneous background of more common plants."

She never observed foliage that was killed or even damaged by such marking, but sometimes up to three wolves would defecate on a single, "popular" plant.

The findings are outlined in a paper published in this month's Animal Behavior.

Where the plants grew was also important. Human-constructed roads wind through the areas where the wolves roam. Taking advantage of these, wolves would defecate on certain plants at crossroads.

"Since crossroads are multi-directional, scats placed at them have a higher probability of being detected," Barja explained. "Wolves can reach these points from different directions and are therefore more likely to encounter them."

The same logic may explain why dogs often do their business at particular places when on walks with their owners.

"In an urban setting, a fire hydrant can be a prominent landmark," Lisa Peterson, director of communications for the American Kennel Club, told Discovery News. "If a dog relieves itself there, other dogs could smell its presence 30 yards away."

She also said that canines appear to emphasize height when marking with urine, with dogs "trying to pee as high as they can on fences and other objects in their environment."

Like a person pumping up their chest and muscles to look big and impressive, highly placed urine could suggest the individual may not be one to reckon with.

Peterson added, "That's probably why when little dogs urinate, they often lift their back leg up as high as possible — sometimes looking as though they're nearly falling over -- because they're trying to pee as high as they possibly can."

While fences, fire hydrants and other urban landmarks are usually in no danger of disappearing anytime soon, Barja worries that clear cutting of vegetation in the wild could disrupt wolf fecal marking.

"It is important to maintain the vegetation of the human constructed roads in the territories of the wolves," she advised.
OK.

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 9:21 pm
by Ze Hiker
next time your around a trail junction and you see a wolf, don't be afraid that he'll attack you, be afraid that he'll pooh on you

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 8:41 am
by EnFuego
:D

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:18 am
by Rumpled
The multiple poops/pees in one spot is no surprise to anyone I'd imagine. They are all competing and when one dog (mainly males) pees there - they all have to.
I've often wondered about my dogs attempting to kick and scatter their poop. I wonder if they are trying to advertise their presence over a larger area. Or, could they even be scattering it to disperse it? The first seems more likely to me.

And, my male doesn't pick prominent bushes to poop - he likes to pick things like ivy where it's difficult to retrieve.

Just my poop observations.

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 9:46 pm
by cougarmagic
Does a bear poop in the woods? (warning - gross image)

Why yes, yes he does....

Image

This lovely specimen was seen today as I rode bikes with some friends from Mt Wilson, down the Rim Trail, and down to the West Fork. Lovely ride, by the way, I recommend it highly. Just watch where you step.

(By the way, these are size 10 shoes, and that is ONE scat from one animal)

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 2:03 pm
by HikeUp
On Occidental Peak (just west of Mt. Wilson)...
IMG_3909.jpg

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 7:34 pm
by cougarmagic
Nice! (as nice as that can be anyway.... :lol: ) I like seeing bear sign again. They really disappeared all winter.

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:49 pm
by Ali
Hi everyone,

on my recent trip to Baldy last Sunday I noticed some rocks falling above me while I was on the fire road heading to the Ski Hut trail. When I got on the trail I noticed some fresh poo and some tracks. I was wondering which animal they might belong to.

sorry for the "crappy" photos. :D

Image
Image

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 8:12 am
by cougarmagic
The only thing I can tell is that it was definitely a carnivore. Black, gooey scat means a recent meal of organ meat. Can't really tell anything from the track. So you're only narrowed down to Coyote, fox, or bobcat...( I think both the scat and track are too small to be a lion or bear - but can't really tell the scale) Probably too big for fox.

What are those square holes in the cement?

Anyone else have ideas?

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 8:58 am
by Mike P
My bet is that it's a pile of canine poop. I vote for coyote. FWIW

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:11 am
by AlanK
I dunno... I'm pretty sure it's Bigfoot.

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 4:06 pm
by Rumpled
Once again, I must vote chupacabra!

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 5:31 pm
by Mike P
AlanK wrote:I dunno... I'm pretty sure it's Bigfoot.
I dunno' Alan. Looking at the track, I would say Littlefoot. :o

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Wed Jan 20, 2010 5:53 pm
by AlanK
Mike P wrote:
AlanK wrote:I dunno... I'm pretty sure it's Bigfoot.
I dunno' Alan. Looking at the track, I would say Littlefoot. :o
Who is a baby that will grow up to be a new Bigfoot?

I ain't takin' chances. No more Baldy for me. (For at least a few days.)

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 2:13 pm
by Sewellymon
Hey All!

My friend/ neighbor here in Sierra Madre found this pile 'o scat in his back driveway. He was just curious-- is this a bear? An Uber- Raccoon? Homeless guy with a high fiber diet?

Inquiring minds NEED to know.

Sarcastic and pithy responses also welcomed.

Image

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 3:06 pm
by Fart Baron
Tell your buddy that I'm sorry about the driveway. :?

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 4:36 pm
by cougarmagic
Nice.

Yep that's bear poop. He's been eating acorns and grass.

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 9:03 pm
by Taco
Fart Baron wrote: Tell your buddy that I'm sorry about the driveway. :?
x2 long night...

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Mon May 23, 2011 10:20 pm
by Sewellymon
Acorn- thanks for the positive ID. Forgot to mention size-- pancake width (8") piled high with the toppings (3").

No surprise tho. San Gab bears love the suburbs. Below is Monrovia, CA's Sampson the Hot Tub. Immortalized by renowned local artist Lynn Fearman for the Monrovia Public Library.

Image

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 4:56 pm
by MattCav
i'm not so good at poo id'ing. anyone know what these two piles are from? they were in the middle of a fire road i hiked on today, just above montecito/santa barbara. there were multiple piles every 15-30 feet or so for a long stretch, making me think somebody wanted to mark its home.

Image

Image

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:43 pm
by mattmaxon
Bear...

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:47 pm
by MattCav
what is the main characteristic that makes you think that, matt? just curious.

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:10 pm
by shreddy
That was me. Too many tacos at the Casa Blanca last night on State Street. YIKES

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:11 pm
by MattCav
muhahaha! nice one shreddy.
i was at casa blanca thursday...their enchilladas are excellente!

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:45 pm
by cougarmagic
Matt's right. (probably...)

Warning - graphic poo description in 3....2......1:

OK - so, first you look for signs of vegetable matter - seeds, pits, grass. That eliminates cats. Lion and bobcat poop will never have berries. It will have a high amount of deer and/or rabbit fur.

Coyotes make scat like this - with berries and grass. But those will be nice compact tubes. And that's because they will have a higher protein (and fur) content. Insoluble fiber, if you will. Coyotes also like to mark a whole lot in one place - it's called a "latrine", and it's a social thing.

Bears, whose diet is something like 90% vegetarian, will have berries, grass, and little to no fur, and be in a huge somewhat amorphous pile. I can see your sneaker in the frame, so these piles look small. But I can't totally judge size from that, so if you think these seemed big ("whoah - that's a lotta sh*t!" big) it was a bear. If not, coyote.

Foxes will have berries in their scat often, but they are tiny, and most often deposited on top of rocks and logs as a clear visual message. I don't know what that message is exactly...but, there it is.

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:16 pm
by MattCav
absolutely brilliant! i very much appreciate your expertise, cm!

and btw, i also appreciated your backing me up in my eaton canyon article. you said the things i wanted to say but had to be careful of :-)

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 9:59 pm
by Mike P
Cougarmagic: scatologist extraordinaire!

My resident gray foxes like to poop ON my pool cover while the cover is on the pool!

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 7:35 am
by simonov
Why do poo threads get so many replies?

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 8:16 am
by cougarmagic
Mike P wrote: Cougarmagic: scatologist extraordinaire!
Mom is so proud. :lol:

Re: All Scat, All the Time

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 8:57 am
by SageUrsus
Shoobie doo bee tok a doo bah dah dootle dee dah dah...

I've recently started to hike early in the morning because of the time change and holy smokes I've noticed A LOT more scat ? on the trail. Its a bunch of little bobcat and fox scat and a couple of coyote ?.

Do y'all notice the same thing or am I just crazy?

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